Diplomacy discussion

[erikuf]

ONCE AGAIN, I HAD A VERY DETAILED EXPLANATION, TIMED OUT LOG IN, AND A LOST POST!


I am still trying to work out all of the scenarios with Jed but in any event, our strategy for right now is simple, build.

Take a good look at the board. We can easily isolate ourselves in the Northwest. This means more scrapping and more talking for yellow and blue.

The diplomacy question for the very first move is this: Will yellow move an army into 14?

This is my proposal:

Spring-

10 to 9
22 to 8
12 to 7

If yellow moves into 14:

Fall-

9 support 7 to 5 (not that support is nesessary, but hey)
8 to 3

If yellow doesn't

Fall-

7 to 6
8 to 3
9 to 5


See the impact: the 6th army!



Just my thoughts, please rip into them. If you dont understand, IM me.

Erik

[Xopher]

Hey all, I'm still having comp problem but have decided to use the local library's computer today. Ok, here is my thought on the situation...we need to remember that this isnt a game of "Risk" where territory scores points, only territory with citadels score points. With that said, I think we need to look at the layout of the board. I agree with Erik, we do have a nice position to isolate ourselves in the corner, which would be advantagous to get the 6 armies, but we run into a few problems. The Elves are surely going to move 35 to 23. And if we move our 22 to 8 it leaves 22 open to attack from the Elves. What I'm thinking is that our territory 12 looks pretty secure at the moment, pretty isolated in the middle away from other species. So what I advocate is the movment 12 to 5, gaining us an immediate new army. Then tomorrow moving one of the armies (army 5A)over to 3, gaining one new army. And at th same time moving army 5B over to 7 so that it can get citadel 6 in its next turn. I think this is a bit more conservative campaign, but it will work just as well. So, my proposed movements: Firstmove:
12 to 5
Secondmove:
5A to 3
5B to 7

But, ultmatley you guys should make the call, the movements are due at 3pm so someone please send in some form of movment by then. Check in soon.
Christopher

[erikuf]

From Jed's rules:

To control a Magic Tower all you need to do is occupy it during winter (after the fall turn) and you gain control.


This might Chris's oversight, both on offense and defense... Allow me to explain:

Offense
12 to 5 in the spring does not gain us an army. Thats why we need two troops to move to acquire the towers on 5 and 6.

Defense
Blue theoretically can occupy 22 in the fall. But if they plan to head in that direction, then they already have a tower in 23. They dont gain two armies from being in 23 and then 22, they only take away our army if they make the second move in the fall (admittedly we don't want that).

All of this in mind, Chris does raise another important question, will blue move into 23? Here is how we should look at it:

If they do, its because we moved the army originally from 22 to 3 (from my original proposal) and we gain and lose and army. In the end, a wash.

If they don't, it might have been the result of our presence. I think its safe to say that we want the northwest and our other two troops well be headed in that direction. This means that the army originally in 22 may be exposed (should blue decide to have a supported campaign into our region). In the end, they don't get our tower but we dont get the tower in 3 and we leave ourselves exposed and we are not isolated.

I still think my original plan is good to go except now perhaps some talks with both teams are in order.


Erik

[Kurtis Blow]

yeah, i really think you guys are going to be better than me at this one. it took me like 3 tries just to read the rules all the way through.

I like the idea o 12 -> 7 and 10 -> 9.

the only one i'm not sure of is 22-3, simply because of the risk-reward situation.

i also still am not quite sure how attacks and support and stuff work. can anyone give a simple explanation??

[Samopolis]

What about this:


SPRING
We take Erik's ideas and surround 23 by moving:
22 to 24
10 to 22

At the same time we pick up our first extra base:
12 to 5


FALL
We add the base at 23 by right of conquest:
22 attacks 23
24 supports "22 attacks 23"

We then add a sixth base:
5 to 3


The winter passes, and we get THREE new units, distributed to our Home Towers: 10, 12, and 22.

What do you think?

[erikuf]

Alright, so I made a small oversight too. From Jed's rules:

For building, you list the order of construction you want in the Home Towers that you still control. There will never be more than three of these, since you can never produce more than three Home Towers.


So we can't leave 22 stranded, a my first proposal suggests. Sam and I talked it out and here is another good idea:

There really is no possibility of gaining 3 towers in one year. Everything would have to work in our favor for that to occur. To be safe, we go after two. Which two? Well, we want to cover our towers, so perhaps isolating ourselves is not the best idea. So, perhaps we steadily occupy those NW towers over time. Which towers to grab for the first year? 5 and 23. How?

Spring-

22 to 24
10 to 22


Fall (and this may be slightly different, but as an example)-

24 support "22 to 23"
12 to 5

Depending on Blue's intentions on 23 will really shape the fall move.


Either of my proposals seem ok, do you want to isolate and guarantee moderate building or get in their face, defend, and possibly build?

[erikuf]

Here is what I am thinking:

Fall-

22 support "24 move to 23"
12 move to 5
(build: 10,12)


Whatcha think?

[erikuf]

slight change:

24 support "22 move to 23"
12 move to 5
(build: 22,12)

[Kurtis Blow]

hey, what happened??

how did we end up building on 10 instead of 12???

[erikuf]

i thought i noted the change to everyone. im sorry if i didnt. i think 10 will be a bit harder for others to read since we could move to 3 for the army or we can move forward to protect. here is what i think for tomorrow:

Spring:

23 move to 25
24 support "23 move to 25"
10 to 9
5 to 12

this still gives us support in the middle and the possibility of grabbing that northernmost tower.

[Kurtis Blow]

ok, firstly, here is the map for easier reference:

http://www.net-benefits.net/survivor/dip_03.jpg

now here is my thinking, which i have already talked to erik about.

thanks to the elves strategy, they have pretty much cornered themselves in the south, and to get any more towers anytime soon, they pretty much HAVE to go through 23, and i think that they will try to use all 3 of their units to get it. therefore, we have to use all 3 of our armies to defend 23 and not let them get anywhere. that will essentially leave them with having to move 26 down to 25, a move which would make it so they couldnt get a new army from 23 for another 4 moves, or retreat east.

so those 3 all hold, 5 moves to 12, and 10 moves to 9.

[erikuf]

I'm down with Kurtis's suggestion

as it stands:

23 hold
22 support 23
24 support 23
10 move to 9
5 move to 12

sorry if i wasnt being too responsive on AIM. i decided i wanted to finish a project TONIGHT (thats due in two weeks) in one shot. no project on the mind = more time for nb :grin


good night everyone

erik

[Kurtis Blow]

ok, the elves made a very good play, undercutting our support from 24 by having 26 attack it.

after this move, the elves will have 7 armies, the dwarves 6, and us 5. needless to say, that is bad.

as of right now, the only move i think that is for sure for us is 10 to 3.

i would like to open talks with the dwarves about teaming up to attack 26.

any other suggestions would be helpful.

[erikuf]

so support is cut if an army is at least attacked. personally, i was under the impression (and still think that its more approproate) that the army had to be dislodged. im sorry, army count will be 7-6-5. lets just make blue suffer for this.